Bobs wrote: Would love to hear some news about the PC platform

God yes. It would stop the pointless speculation at least. Some details are required asap.

cryocore wrote: So tell me again what was your point because as far as I can see you have made a statement about a scenerio that hasnt happened and will never happen as being whats wrong with the concept of crowd funding. Your initial statement still makes zero sense.

Beamdog is a digital distribution service and will be publishing this remake exclusively to their store, for them to use crowd sourced funding as a alternate pre-order system seems a bit...

cryocore wrote: Stop talkin out of your arse. I explained why I am not concerned (which you ignored). The fact that we have no idea whats being done mean you are just overreacting. WE DONT KNOW WHATS HAPPENING!!!! I honestly think you're being an idiot here. If some actual evidence appears that backs up your claim then and only then can you bitch about whats lacking. Did the enhanced editions of Monkey Island suffer for being multi platform...? Because for my money they were pretty ****en good, but no they MUST HAVE BEEN DIMINISHED. Seriously at least when I have a rant I have something tangible to back it up. You're 100% speculation with nothing to back it up. So please tell me exactly what things will be lost/not done/dumbed down because there will be a seperate iPad port? Specifics only. Thank you.

Command Centre costs 300 minerals, Orbital Command costs 450 minerals. Command Centre can do the job of collecting resources, but an Orbital Command does it better. The more you have the more you can do. Do you deny this? Go make a full volume milkshake with 50% of the ingredient volume. Tell me how that pans out.

Specifics are up to the game designer, but then you knew that. You want specifics? BiG World Project. Im not saying do a copy/paster, but my point is there is always more to do. Those who know what BWP is will know that BG EE wont step to it at all for game content and physical area. Because

BWP has had far more time, and people working for free. More resource, more/better product.

Analgia wrote: Beamdog is a digital distribution service and will be publishing this remake exclusively to their store, for them to use crowd sourced funding as a alternate pre-order system seems a bit...

How so? If they can not get the funds through other means then crowd sourcing seems perfectly acceptable to me. You seem very hung up on the money side of things which raises an eyebrow on my end. If they can get the money and stay out of the big publishers pockets then more power to them.

Nakor wrote: Specifics are up to the game designer, but then you knew that. You want specifics? BiG World Project. Im not saying do a copy/paster, but my point is there is always more to do. Those who know what BWP is will know that BG EE wont step to it at all for game content and physical area. Because BWP has had far more time, and people working for free. More resource, more/better product.

Well if you want enything even remotely like BWP for the EE then seriously get ****ed. I love the project but it changes the games far too much.
Any enhanced/updated edition should not alter the core game and BWP rewrites the story, interactions, and adds a shit ton of non BG elements to the game. Sorry now you're just being idiotic.

My brain is full of **** at the idea of incorporating anything like BWP in to a re-release of a game. Seriously ****en retarded idea.

Sounds to me that you dont want an enhanced game, you wants a fundamentally redesigned and altered one. Which is not what an EE is.

Look at MDK II, or Monkley Island 1 and 2, or Ico, or Shadow of the Colossus or Beyond good and Evil HD. You update, you dont completely change. IMO TSOMI and MI2 EE were exactly how you do it. You update the sound, visuals, and interface but leave the core game unaltered. You might add some tweaks, or some additional content, but nothing more.

You cant change the game so that new players and returning players have a different core game, or a dramatically changed one.
What you want will NOT happen, and should NEVER happen.

[edit]

Nakor wrote: Command Centre costs 300 minerals, Orbital Command costs 450 minerals. Command Centre can do the job of collecting resources, but an Orbital Command does it better. The more you have the more you can do. Do you deny this? Go make a full volume milkshake with 50% of the ingredient volume. Tell me how that pans out.

Sweet jesus man. What drugs are you taking?
Did ever occur to you that all the improvements they want to do have been done? I dont mean the stupid and utterly idiotic shit you want, but they have actually made the EE as they want it? It seems to me that the PC version is done, and they are currently working in the iPad UI.

You wanting massive alterations is YOUR desire. Not theirs, and certainly not mine. BGEE is an update not a remake. Your expectations are so far beyond what this project was ever going to be. I understand now why you're bleating so let me be clear. What you want wont happen. It wont happen because what you want will never be part of any EE. You want a remake. This ISNT a remake.

Are we clear now?

I used the BWP as an example that there is more to put in. I did specify I didnt want a copy paste of it. Simply the VOLUME of new stuff in BWP. I certainly didnt mention incorporating BWP into BG EE. You asked for specifics, I simply gave a broad example of the incredible ammount of junk you can add in response to your implicit point that there was nothing else that the resources porting would use up could be used on.

If they have done all the things they wanted to BG EE, that is fine good on them. That doesnt mean that I personally have to like it, or that I have to be fully ok with their decisions, or that I wont have ideas and feedback on what could be diffrent, or included. It would also be actually amazing for a game dev to get all the things they want perfect in the game.

And I dont want a remake. I want an enhanced BG. Its BG with a +1 enchantment. Same thing, but with more stuff.

-----

Wait a few turns for berserk to wear off, and once you get your fatigue and HP back and can think beyond getting angry at me for things you think the stuff i said dont even mean.

I can't wait till this comes out and is a remake

Nakor wrote: I used the BWP as an example that there is more to put in. I did specify I didnt want a copy paste of it. Simply the VOLUME of new stuff in BWP. I certainly didnt mention incorporating BWP into BG EE. You asked for specifics, I simply gave a broad example of the incredible ammount of junk you can add in response to your implicit point that there was nothing else that the resources porting would use up could be used on. If they have done all the things they wanted to BG EE, that is fine good on them. That doesnt mean that I personally have to like it, or that I have to be fully ok with their decisions, or that I wont have ideas and feedback on what could be diffrent, or included. It would also be actually amazing for a game dev to get all the things they want perfect in the game. And I dont want a remake. I want an enhanced BG. Its BG with a +1 enchantment. Same thing, but with more stuff. ----- Wait a few turns for berserk to wear off, and once you get your fatigue and HP back and can think beyond getting angry at me for things you think the stuff i said dont even mean.

That VOLUME of stuff was what I was referring to. You cant have that many changes without it being in addition to the core game.
An EE is just that. Its the EXACT same game given an update. That could entail any combination of GFX, Sound, Interface, and little else. You seem to be wanting ADDITIONAL things put in.
No.
That should never happen, and from the very little info given thus far it wont. You're making assumptions about the potential quality/quantity of changes based on an unrealistic and fundamentally flawed expectation. If your expectation is something of the scope of BWP or even 50% or 25% of that then you're going to be disappointed. That was never going to happen and the VAST majority of the changes are ADDITIONS to the core game, and all the rest are changes to the core game (excluding the fixes).

As I said look at the Monkey Island EE's thats more in tune with my expectations and even then I expect a lot less than that because that game is considerable older and needed a lot of updating to modern standards. BG requires considerably less. All it needs is higher resolutions, widescreen, some additional functionality with the UI and thats about it. They could put in more voice acting but unless its the same voice actors they shouldnt and even then its not something I think is needed or even all that important. The sprites could also be improved but I dont see any reason for anything else.

If ALL of things were dont it would not require a budget, and not a lot of time. Your paranoia around it being affected by an iPad version is unfounded. They are not rebuilding and shouldnt be. Its your unrealistic and frankly bizarre expectations that are out of whack here, not the focus of the team.

My brain is still full of **** over what you seem to think the EE should entail. If it alters the core game it should not be there. An EE is a tweak and a facelift. Nothing more, which is why your rant about the port taking resources away is invalid.

cryocore wrote: How so? If they can not get the funds through other means then crowd sourcing seems perfectly acceptable to me. You seem very hung up on the money side of things which raises an eyebrow on my end. If they can get the money and stay out of the big publishers pockets then more power to them.

If one publisher can do it what's to stop Mass Effect 5 or Halo 6 being "crowd funded"? Why would you raise eyebrows do you have some sort of muscle condition?

Analgia wrote: If one publisher can do it what's to stop Mass Effect 5 or Halo 6 being "crowd funded"? Why would you raise eyebrows do you have some sort of muscle condition?

What publisher? Apart from 2 self funded enhanced editions they have not funded any products at all. Do you consider Valve a publisher?
Comparing a tiny company with limited resources with any of the big boys is a bit of a stretch.
Crowd sourcing works because its Devs talking directly to the target audience and their faith in the project. There would be considerable negative impact if a large publisher tried it. Hell it would generate a shit storm of negative publicity. It wont happen. Not to mention that because of the size of the audience it would be so polarising that the end product would piss a lot of people off because those that got involved earlier would feel more entitled than those who waited for a release before paying. It work on good faith and community. In large scale it will cause more problems than its worth.

Hypothetically say it did happen and EA crowd sourced for Mass Effect 4. Why should I/you care apart from the fact its the rich asking for money? It is voluntary, you get a completed product for the same financial cost as buying the completed game.

edit: ^^ above +1

Analgia wrote: If one publisher can do it what's to stop Mass Effect 5 or Halo 6 being "crowd funded"? Why would you raise eyebrows do you have some sort of muscle condition?

Difference being, who would support Mass Effect 5 like this? EA could try but doubtful much would come of it.

When a beggar wearing a Armani suit asks you for a dollar to buy a sandwich, you probs wont give him a dollar would you?

cryocore wrote: What publisher? Apart from 2 self funded enhanced editions they have not funded any products at all.

They are selling more than 2 games: http://www.beamdog.com/

cryocore wrote: Do you consider Valve a publisher?

Steam sells games so yes

Analgia wrote: Steam sells games so yes

The Warehouse also sells games, doesn't make them a publisher

Analgia wrote: Steam sells games so yes

Analgia wrote: Steam sells games so yes

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.... sorry..... BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Yeah you can stop now as you have no idea what you're talking about. Yeah perhaps you better look up what publishing means.
Random House is a book publisher. Whitcoulls is a retailer.
Activision is a game publisher. Steam, Gamestop, EB, Mightyape, Beamdog etc are retailers.

Had some chicken for lunch published by KFC

cryocore wrote: BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.... sorry..... BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH Yeah you can stop now as you have no idea what you're talking about. Yeah perhaps you better look up what publishing means. Random House is a book publisher. Whitcoulls is a retailer. Activision is a game publisher. Steam, Gamestop, EB, Mightyape, Beamdog etc are retailers.

Don't Valve publish their games themselves now? I don't think Sierra/Vivendi have published anything for them since Half-Life 2.

Neoptolemus wrote: Don't Valve publish their games themselves now? I don't think Sierra/Vivendi have published anything for them since Half-Life 2.

I'm sorry did I mention Valve at all?
Steam is an online store. It is owned by Valve but isnt Valve. 99.99% of games on Steam are NOT Valve titles. Valve did not develop or in any way fund their production and from memory Valve still dont publish the Brick and Mortar versions of their titles
Amazon produces Kindles it doesnt make Amazon.com a manufacturer and is also completely beside the point.

cryocore wrote: I'm sorry did I mention Valve at all?

cryocore wrote: Do you consider Valve a publisher?

That would be a yes then...

cryocore wrote: Steam is an online store. It is owned by Valve but isnt Valve. 99.99% of games on Steam are NOT Valve titles. Valve did not develop or in any way fund their production and from memory Valve still dont publish the Brick and Mortar versions of their titles Amazon produces Kindles it doesnt make Amazon.com a manufacturer and is also completely beside the point.

Saying Steam != Valve is pure semantics. The two are closely enough linked to be to used interchangeably.

The question I was asking was exactly the one you speculate about. I know that Valve no longer give a publisher credit on their games, which means that they no longer have a formal publisher.

Valve are probably most accurately termed 'self-publishing developers' rather than publishers though, since they don't publish 3rd party games.

The reality of computer games (and in fact any digital media) is that it's possible to go straight from developer to retailer effectively.

Neoptolemus wrote: Saying Steam != Valve is pure semantics. The two are closely enough linked to be to used interchangeably. The question I was asking was exactly the one you speculate about. I know that Valve no longer give a publisher credit on their games, which means that they no longer have a formal publisher. Valve are probably most accurately termed 'self-publishing developers' rather than publishers though, since they don't publish 3rd party games. The reality of computer games (and in fact any digital media) is that it's possible to go straight from developer to retailer effectively.

Quote: they don't publish 3rd party games.

Is about the only valid thing you said.

So because its owned and operated by Valve it IS Valve?
Steam is product. Steam is an online retail platform. Steam is not a publisher. Steam is not Valve. Steam is owned, and operated by Valve. They are distinct and separate. Its not semantics, its just fact.
but this is all beside the point as Steam is not actually what is being discussed.

Thread is so far of the rails now.

back on topic.

Quote: those hoping to relive the classic RPG on their console of choice are in for disappointment. Trent Oster of Beamdog / Overhaul Games has made it clear via Twitter that his studio intends to pursue a console-free strategy, adding that porting Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition to PlayStation 3 or Xbox 360 would require them to "change the game too much." He also shares some interesting factoids on the title's development, revealing that it took 14 months of negotiating with several companies attached to Baldur's Gate to reach a deal that allowed Overhaul to proceed with work on the game.

How about we actually discuss the ****ing game called Baldur's Gate.

cryocore wrote: Yeah you can stop now as you have no idea what you're talking about. Yeah perhaps you better look up what publishing means.

Valve handles the marketing, digital distribution and feature set (steamworks). What else does a publisher do?

Analgia wrote: Valve handles the marketing, digital distribution and feature set (steamworks). What else does a publisher do?

Pay for the game would be one thing.

And can we get back on topic?

Analgia wrote: Valve handles the marketing

No they dont. They will advertise its on Steam, you know like ANY retailer does about products they sell

Analgia wrote: digital distribution

Yes and thats all they do

Analgia wrote: and feature set (steamworks).

No they dont. When publishers or developers decide to use Steam its something offered with being on the platform. Using Steamworks is a decision made by the Publisher and/or Developer.

Analgia wrote: What else does a publisher do?

Fund production as in paying for the game to be made.
Pay for all marketing and promotion, as is all advertising (TV, Internet, etc), booths at game conventions, and communicating with Gaming media, provide preview and review copies.

You're absolutely wrong. Now can we get this back on track.
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I am wondering why there is so little (make that zero) actual information about what is being 'enhanced'. One would think that you would highlight the enhancements as a promotional strategy.
I am also wondering how hard it would be for a modder to use the enhanced engine to tweak the other Infinity Engine games.

ffs Cryo just let it go.

I wonder what the rough time frame for release will be?
Gonna see if I can buy and download the originals tonight. Went to install this yesterday and was missing one cd. FKN RAAAAAAAGE

wtfs going on in here

I want some baldur's gate shiiit