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  1. Post
    For several outcomes measures - core ADHD symptoms, organization, and self-esteem - those receiving CBT + meds improved more quickly
    Although those receiving CBT only generally caught up by the end of the study, this was more than a full year out (4 months CBT, 3 months of booster session, and final follow-up 3 months later).
    To be candid, it could be difficult to procure this treatment in many communities; medication, of course, is available pretty much everywhere.
    For the purposes of abbreviating that's what I took from your post.

  2. Post
    ChineseKiwi wrote:
    Too all the doubters:

    This graph is basically the story of my life at the moment:



    I have both Concerta 54mg and Ritalin LA 30mg.

    That 6 hour Concerta peak for me is yes, too much dose wise. Quite rapid (noticeably) heartbeat, cannot concentrate / focus for that peak, slight physical jitteriness and anxiety. A headache that isn't 'pounding' but more like a wall but it's not like banging your head against it, but more it moves with you.

    Going down a bit, it's great, it's fantastic, more social, more focus, things happen more 'automatically' and 'naturally', like you know, having normal dopamine and neurotransmitter activities. And yes, it IS neurological, brain scans show this easily vs other people who don't have it like every other mental disorder or illness.

    With the Ritalin LA, the comedown is worse as seen above. I don't 'feel' it as much (despite equivalent dose) but I know it's working 'in the background' more and I do things easier, improving my life, but I
    Maybe I need a lower dose of Concerta, I dunno. Don't like experimenting like this at all, but it needs to be done really, unless I can afford to do that genetic testing, because genetics play a role in how quickly you absorb the drug and what dose is best.

    So yes, there is a thing as too much and it is noticeable to people and is adverse.

    Different timing of the release of doses in why there is the differences (50/50 for Ritalin LA, 22/78 for Concerta).
    At the start of this thread I mentioned micro doses of medication (methylphenidate). Have you looked into this yet?

  3. Post
    refused wrote:
    At the start of this thread I mentioned micro doses of medication (methylphenidate). Have you looked into this yet?
    Like taking 3-4 lower doses of instant release?

    Yeah, tried and it doesn't work as effectively due to rollercoaster levels (see graph and personal experience). I was initially on instant release.

    Not to mention it is more maintenance.

    Ritalin LA + top up as required later in the day works very well. I can control the timing more too if when I take that topup to suit what I want for that day as well.

  4. Post
    uhh im pretty sure microdosing amphetamines is bad for you. However ritalin isnt an amphetamine so im not sure. kevinl signal?

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2440058

  5. Post
    ChineseKiwi wrote:
    and brain scans are literally the best final diagnosis for it and gene testing the best for allocation of dose and meds but that shit expensive yo.
    Brain scans aren't used in the diagnosis of any psychiatric disorder, unless somethings changed in the last 2 months

  6. Post
    Boreas wrote:
    Brain scans aren't used in the diagnosis of any psychiatric disorder, unless somethings changed in the last 2 months
    They only aren't because they're expensive.

  7. Post
    So let me get this straight, science has a system of brain scans and gene testing that can precisely determine the nature of someone's psychiatric issues, and also the necessary dosage to cure someone, but it's not enacted due to cost?

  8. Post
    ChineseKiwi wrote:
    They only aren't because they're expensive.
    No, it's because the scans don't usually tell us anything. What's true for a group is not always true for an individual. Hundreds of people get scanned every day for other things, if it was useful a psychiatrist could order one too.

    A brain scan might assist the diagnosis of some dementias, and exclude some neurological causes of psychiatric symptoms. But you can't look at any single scan anywhere and say "this person has ADHD".

  9. Post
    Also gene testing isn't sufficiently accurate to really guide medication choices. It's a very complex interplay of many genes for the most part.

  10. Post
    there is a diagnostic EEG available for childhood ADHD (FDA approved), if you call that a brain scan.

  11. Post
    I'm not sure how beneficial brain scans are TBH, they're going to tell you different parts of the brain are lighting up but it doesn't give you a cause or fix. It'd be handy tracking changes in brain activity following various treatments I guess.

    What intrigues me is epigenetics. It seems like modern life with its complexity and speed influence anxiety and depression manifesting in people, from the looks of it this can get passed on to children or grandchildren genetically, so there will likely be a cumulative increase in mental illness over the coming generations. Like an invisible plague.

  12. Post
    bradc wrote:
    I'm not sure how beneficial brain scans are TBH, they're going to tell you different parts of the brain are lighting up but it doesn't give you a cause or fix. It'd be handy tracking changes in brain activity following various treatments I guess.

    Brain scans may be flawed http://ideas.ted.com/much-of-what-we...lem-with-fmri/

    bradc wrote:
    What intrigues me is epigenetics. It seems like modern life with its complexity and speed influence anxiety and depression manifesting in people, from the looks of it this can get passed on to children or grandchildren genetically, so there will likely be a cumulative increase in mental illness over the coming generations. Like an invisible plague.
    Yep... think of the institutionalized abuse in western societies. Children viewed as possessions, corporal punishment, Victorian England etc etc. I read something about that in ancient Greece, sexual abuse of children was the norm rather than an exception..

  13. Post
    Nothing like your professional development being held back significantly because you're ****ing unable to be consistent in your ****in life because it's always up or down, fluoroextine or not

  14. Post
    Join the club. Unfortunately we don't have leather jackets.

    and re brain scans; Pdocs generally do diagnosis off your symptoms and reported states. We're not advanced enough yet to do an MRI and infer x/y/z for someone's mental health.

  15. Post
    Brain scans for mood and anxiety disorders sounds like bollocks.

    Try some pills. If they don't work, don't take them. If they do work, good.

  16. Post
    EEG works, fMRI is barely better than a coin flip.

  17. Post
    sorceror wrote:
    EEG works
    What would it be telling the doctor that he can't get from a basic consultation?

    "You tell me you're depressed but this brain scan speaks otherwise"

  18. Post
    purplez wrote:
    Nothing like your professional development being held back significantly because you're ****ing unable to be consistent in your ****in life because it's always up or down, fluoroextine or not
    hear hear. Tis a shame nothing I've tried works.

  19. Post
    Quasi ELVIS wrote:
    What would it be telling the doctor that he can't get from a basic consultation?

    "You tell me you're depressed but this brain scan speaks otherwise"
    it's for ADHD, and sometimes it's very difficult to have a basic consultation - ie with a young child

    also look at CK - as per this thread he had ADHD for a long time but no NZ doctor could figure it out. maybe an EEG would've helped.

  20. Post
    sorceror wrote:
    it's for ADHD, and sometimes it's very difficult to have a basic consultation - ie with a young child
    If they're too young to talk about it, maybe they're too young to be mainlining ritalin.

    sorceror wrote:
    also look at CK - as per this thread he had ADHD for a long time but no NZ doctor could figure it out. maybe an EEG would've helped.
    Until someone who actually knows about it says otherwise, I doubt it.

  21. Post
    sorceror wrote:
    also look at CK - as per this thread he had ADHD for a long time but no NZ doctor could figure it out. maybe an EEG would've helped.
    It could be though that his behaviour changed to such a degree as he fit an ADHD profile better later on - symptoms can vary over time.

  22. Post
    purplez wrote:
    Nothing like your professional development being held back significantly because you're ****ing unable to be consistent in your ****in life because it's always up or down, fluoroextine or not
    I really think up or down is a common human experience. I don't think there's a person alive who wakes up feeling the same every morning.

  23. Post
    Quasi ELVIS wrote:
    Try some pills. If they don't work, don't take them. If they do work, good.
    Ah great, now I'm redundant.

  24. Post
    sorceror wrote:
    it's for ADHD, and sometimes it's very difficult to have a basic consultation - ie with a young child

    also look at CK - as per this thread he had ADHD for a long time but no NZ doctor could figure it out. maybe an EEG would've helped.
    With young children, it's based on what the parents (+teachers) say, and what the kid does in the room. I'm not aware of any evidence for EEGs in the diagnosis of ADHD.

    I can often barely get ADHD children to sit still long enough to take a blood pressure; I wish the best of luck to anyone that tries to administer an EEG. Whether the child can sit through it would probably be more diagnostic than the actual EEG reading itself, at this point in the time.

  25. Post
    yeah they will need to sit still for a min while you get the electrodes on.

    i doubt it's available outside the US anyway

    http://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsro.../ucm360811.htm
    https://nebahealth.com/faq.html