A thread to discuss how Jacinda will make NZ Choice again

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  1. Post
    Edward Diego wrote:
    Source?
    Colfo. Generally they've been fairly reliable. They have too much of a reputation to lose by making unsubstantiated and erroneous claims.

    Pandaemonaeon wrote:
    I'm torn on it.
    IMO there was a systematic failure that made it possible to own MSSA's without an E-Cat, and legally buy parts that changed them from A-Cat to E-Cat without holding an E-Cat license (this is as much on the ethics of criminal pieces of shit like Tipple though, as they were knowingly making money selling parts to people who were going to illegally use their firearms).
    Plenty of people had genuine reasons to use them, whether it be for work or competition shooting, but those were generally the ones who had E-Cat's, and had their firearms registered.
    That was due to police policy and the courts being in favour of gun rights.

    Look up Lincoln vs police. A judicial review about a police policy to reclassify certain styles of cosmetic gun stocks as MSSA.

    It wasn't based on law and they were shot down by the judge.

    Up until then AR and AK had been very expensive and not very common.

    swazi wrote:
    Mate just got his license, less than a month ago. He was in the process of getting a safe when the Arms Officer asked if he could come round. He told AO that he didnt yet have a safe so wasnt quite prepared. AO said just get some chain and a padlock. And also all he wanted to see was access into the roof cavity and thats it. Why is that still an acceptable means of security?
    And this how 51 Muslims die.

    Not taking arms management seriously has caused this great country a world of hurt.

    It's still acceptable because the law hasn't been updated and police policy.

    The law states that the security should prevent the access by children and opportunistic thieves.

    Am enquiry should be held into what security is required to make a difference and if the government is serious about getting the security updated then they should make it a condition to get your license and bulk buy the safe to get a very good price.

  2. Post
    I'm pretty sure driver licensing is stricter than gun licensing in this Country...

  3. Post
    Pandaemonaeon wrote:
    IMO that's the way I see it too.
    Beyond contract pest control and service shooting it's pretty hard to justify to people that they are necessary.
    Well now it is. Last year it was very easy as they'd never been used in a crime and even a category ar15's rarely featured.

    Timmi wrote:
    Eagle commented the average person doesn't give a shit about guns, thus aren't helping the minority (gun owners) when in reality the average person isn't indifferent, they are passively against.

    the frequency of gun related issues isn't a barometer of public opinion.. there's an obvious net negative risk/benefit conclusion when you aren't invested, especially after CHCH.

    the police put more dice in the cup, but the fact we had to wait for a 7 to come up, when the risk is asymmetric and we've seen what's going on in the US.. it's a rendition of many big problems at the mo..
    Well put it this way. Virtually everyone I know who doesn't own guns has no clue what the arms act actually states.

    They are more likely just ignorant and have no experience. If they have a go and don't like them then that's fine. But a lot of people have opinions on things they have no experience with.

    The police actively destroyed arms management systematically and as you said. Drastically increased the chances of an event happening until it was an inevitable result.

  4. Post
    brand wrote:
    I'm pretty sure driver licensing is stricter than gun licensing in this Country...
    I'm pretty sure (absolutely certain) it isn't

  5. Post
    brand wrote:
    I'm pretty sure driver licensing is stricter than gun licensing in this Country...
    It isn't, which is one of the contributing factors to our road toll. The idea that parents can just teach their kids to drive is crazy.

  6. Post
    Mr sika wrote:
    And this how 51 Muslims die.

    Not taking arms management seriously has caused this great country a world of hurt.

    It's still acceptable because the law hasn't been updated and police policy.

    The law states that the security should prevent the access by children and opportunistic thieves.

    Am enquiry should be held into what security is required to make a difference and if the government is serious about getting the security updated then they should make it a condition to get your license and bulk buy the safe to get a very good price.
    Wait so there haven't been any changes when applying for a gun license? it's just the same stuff as before?

  7. Post
    CODChimera wrote:
    Wait so there haven't been any changes when applying for a gun license? it's just the same stuff as before?
    Its slightly different, there's now a practical handling part (which should have existed all along). Although it's essentially a quick show and tell. Mate said theirs was over in an hour, and that's with the theory test. So basically still inadequate. But I'm sure the police in their wisdom know better than "gun-nuts"

  8. Post
    CODChimera wrote:
    Wait so there haven't been any changes when applying for a gun license? it's just the same stuff as before?
    As stated pretty much.

    They've brought back the local arms officers and vetters. Which should have never been fired in the first place.

    But yes. Same old process as before and a huge back log to get through

  9. Post
    sorceror wrote:
    of course but I'm not talking from an agency point of view, I'm saying the member of the public who discovered the vulnerability should contact CERT who then kick off incident response and get whoever involved - rather than forwarding the information on to further an agenda (or just stir shit).

    that is the correct process - not sure why we are arguing about it.
    I disagree. The public really don't know who the CERT or NCSC are. More probably know who netsafe are tbh. The first port of call is usually the owner of the website, in this case Police.

  10. Post
    The public also generally don't discover breaches. Id expect anyone who's clever enough to discover one to also be able to spend 2 seconds googling to see where they should report it

  11. Post
    sorceror wrote:
    The public also generally don't discover breaches. Id expect anyone who's clever enough to discover one to also be able to spend 2 seconds googling to see where they should report it
    I thought in this instance they did report it first, to police who basically said nothing to see here.

  12. Post
    Th3WhiteKnight wrote:
    I thought in this instance they did report it first, to police who basically said nothing to see here.
    i was talking about reporting breaches in general but as mentioned by others earlier, police aren't the best option - they have a vested interest in covering up the breach (and also a vested interest in arresting people). CERT is the safe option.

  13. Post
    sorceror wrote:
    The public also generally don't discover breaches. Id expect anyone who's clever enough to discover one to also be able to spend 2 seconds googling to see where they should report it
    In this case it seems it was a a non-technical discovery (from the COLFO lawyers):

    The information was, at our request, sent to us directly by one of the people who drew to COLFO attention the fact that when he logged into the portal to complete a notification, he found he had access to what appeared to be the notifications of an extraordinary number of other notifications.
    They follow up saying other users were able to validate the claim and screenshots were captures as proof.

    I'm not sure what is happening now as the Police have gone quiet. Feedback from the firearms community is that the handin database system has been completely shutdown. I wonder if there is also a data integrity issue.

  14. Post
    All confiscation is done paper based now

  15. Post
    Mr sika wrote:
    All confiscation is done paper based now
    Yeah that concerns me. How many paper records have they lost over the years? I really don't want my door kicked in at 5am on the 21st December because some numpty lost my last hand in form with e-cat registered stripped lower receivers on it.

  16. Post
    Th3WhiteKnight wrote:
    Yeah that concerns me. How many paper records have they lost over the years? I really don't want my door kicked in at 5am on the 21st December because some numpty lost my last hand in form with e-cat registered stripped lower receivers on it.
    Most of E, B and C are wrong.

    Just go on holiday and empty your wife's panty drawer along with any guns/equipment and valuables to store with a mate.

  17. Post

  18. Post
    Enough of this whiny gun nonsense.

  19. Post
    Zarkov wrote:
    Enough of this whiny gun nonsense.
    If you have to resort to trying to paint us as childish then you know you've lost and don't have a reasonable argument.

  20. Post
    Mr sika wrote:
    If you have to resort to trying to paint us as childish then you know you've lost and don't have a reasonable argument.
    No one cares.

    Your argument was lost the moment that guy walked into that mosque with a military style firearm.

    Not your fault, but bitching about it makes no difference.

    You know that right?

  21. Post
    Zarkov wrote:
    No one cares.

    Your argument was lost the moment that guy walked into that mosque with a military style firearm.

    Not your fault, but bitching about it makes no difference.

    You know that right?
    Not really. But people who capitulated to public emotion and capitalised on it meant that we were in for a roller coaster.

    Yes. Doesn't mean that I should stop trying to save what's left and doing so by educating people.

  22. Post
    Zarkov isn't all there, so I wouldn't stress about what he has to say.

  23. Post
    WeenieBeenie wrote:
    Zarkov isn't all there, so I wouldn't stress about what he has to say.
    Well summing it up as "no one cares" and thinking it's only about people losing their firearms makes him look that way.

  24. Post
    WeenieBeenie wrote:
    Zarkov isn't all there, so I wouldn't stress about what he has to say.
    Yep had written him off as diminished mental capacity a long time ago.

  25. Post
    White Island erupts. Who’s to blame? Jacinda ardern of course.