Jordan Peterson - Neo-classic views in 5 mins or less

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  1. Post
    Lethargic wrote:
    Yes, I believe so.
    Yup, cannabis will make me sleep like a baby, but if I never feel as refreshed as a good sober nights sleep.

  2. Post
    I see Whitcoulls have expunged Peterson's book from their shelves and catalogue because of a photo that has emerged of him with a fan wearing "I'm a proud islamaphobe" t-shirt.... New Zealand, a country who will judge and deplatform you based on the opinion of someone you stood next to once for 12 seconds.

  3. Post
    seem to be a tad over reaction considering if you looked hard enough there are far more objectionable writers, authors and biographies of various white supremist, neo nazis etc on the shelves. But i guess JP just is standing out even more and needs to be knocked in.

  4. Post
    Meanwhile this woman has been invited to attend some writers festival in Dunedin...I'm guessing the anti-Lauren Southern, Molyneaux, JBP crowd will be along any minute to prevent such outrageous abuse of freedom of speach in this country and destabilise her platform

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  5. Post
    Indigo1 wrote:
    Meanwhile this woman has been invited to attend some writers festival in Dunedin...I'm guessing the anti-Lauren Southern, Molyneaux, JBP crowd will be along any minute to prevent such outrageous abuse of freedom of speach in this country and destabilise her platform

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    I'm interested where you got that - it looks either out of context or playing up to stereotype for comedic effect or a sort of eye roll/being facetious. I suppose post Chch this language, no matter the context, may embolden someone to act out.

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/enter...own-words.html
    Why did she say those things? It was, she says, a joke. A joke at her own 'man hater' image, a joke about how women's rights activists have always been perceived.

    "What's not pointed out in this collage of my tweets is that I'm often responding to people who are saying ludicrous things like 'feminists like you hate all men and want them to die'," she says.

    "There's only so many times you can hear those things before you want to react to them with the nonsense that they are."

  6. Post
    This is off-topic but I don't want to dump it on the emotional Chch thread. Also I suspect there's significant overlap with the Jordan Peterson fanbase. If there's interest we could have a thread *shrug*

    So basically someone in the Chch thread listed Sargon of Akkad as "far right", a bizarre characterisation which is significant because the media frequently uses it. It isn't simply an uninformed comment. My question is how this is justified.

    On the political spectrum he's *precisely* where I am now, a significantly libertarian centrist. You could once use "liberal" to describe this position but now that confuses people. I certainly don't see anything "far right" about this position. It's similar to describing Jordan Peterson's views on personal freedom as right wing when they are just basic liberal values.

    So what are the arguments in favour of Sargon being "far right"?

    -He's a bit of knob when criticising people
    True but apolitical as anyone who has ever discussed politics will have noticed.
    -He values freedom of speech over political correctness
    True but freedom of speech is a core liberal value. He takes it further than most would but that's his prerogative.
    -He is mostly reaching millennials online rather than traditional audiences
    Well we could redefine millennial audiences as "far right" but that would have no value.
    -He supports UK independence
    You could point to ethno-nationalism, but there's more than one reason people don't want to be part of the European Union. Ethno-nationalism is one of the less likely reasons.
    -BBC and all the trusted authorities said so
    Sadly this still works on a lot of people. The question is not which label they used but whether their reasoning stands up to any scrutiny.

    Willing to learn so fill me in with what I've missed.

  7. Post
    lumpy custard wrote:
    This is off-topic but I don't want to dump it on the emotional Chch thread. Also I suspect there's significant overlap with the Jordan Peterson fanbase. If there's interest we could have a thread *shrug*

    So basically someone in the Chch thread listed Sargon of Akkad as "far right", a bizarre characterisation which is significant because the media frequently uses it. It isn't simply an uninformed comment. My question is how this is justified.

    On the political spectrum he's *precisely* where I am now, a significantly libertarian centrist. You could once use "liberal" to describe this position but now that confuses people. I certainly don't see anything "far right" about this position. It's similar to describing Jordan Peterson's views on personal freedom as right wing when they are just basic liberal values.

    So what are the arguments in favour of Sargon being "far right"?

    -He's a bit of knob when criticising people
    True but apolitical as anyone who has ever discussed politics will have noticed.
    -He values freedom of speech over political correctness
    True but freedom of speech is a core liberal value. He takes it further than most would but that's his prerogative.
    -He is mostly reaching millennials online rather than traditional audiences
    Well we could redefine millennial audiences as "far right" but that would have no value.
    -He supports UK independence
    You could point to ethno-nationalism, but there's more than one reason people don't want to be part of the European Union. Ethno-nationalism is one of the less likely reasons.
    -BBC and all the trusted authorities said so
    Sadly this still works on a lot of people. The question is not which label they used but whether their reasoning stands up to any scrutiny.

    Willing to learn so fill me in with what I've missed.
    Off the top of my head he blames feminism for Elliot Rogers

    Got kicked out of ukip for being too extreme

  8. Post
    lumpy custard wrote:
    .
    isn't' anyone that prioritizes logical rationality over emotional rationality instantly on the right and vise versa? That's why JP gets ripped so hard isn't it?

  9. Post
    Indigo1 wrote:
    Meanwhile this woman has been invited to attend some writers festival in Dunedin...I'm guessing the anti-Lauren Southern, Molyneaux, JBP crowd will be along any minute to prevent such outrageous abuse of freedom of speach in this country and destabilise her platform

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    Just so we're clear, you think some tweets that are *clearly* not serious are equivalent to white supremacists like Southern, who travelled to Europe with the intention of sinking refugee ships with a bunch of neo-nazis?

    Timmi wrote:
    isn't' anyone that prioritizes logical rationality over emotional rationality instantly on the right and vise versa? That's why JP gets ripped so hard isn't it?

    Ben Shapiro would like to think so but no.

  10. Post
    NaCh0 wrote:
    Off the top of my head he blames feminism for Elliot Rogers

    Got kicked out of ukip for being too extreme
    Wrong and wrong... but don't let that stop you from trying again.

  11. Post
    Indigo1 wrote:
    Meanwhile this woman has been invited to attend some writers festival in Dunedin...I'm guessing the anti-Lauren Southern, Molyneaux, JBP crowd will be along any minute to prevent such outrageous abuse of freedom of speach in this country and destabilise her platform
    Clementine isn't all that bad, think it's pretty obvious she's only interested in strengthening her position.. all kind of bishops thinking they can win just playing with their own squares.

  12. Post
    Esprit wrote:
    Wrong and wrong... but don't let that stop you from trying again.
    Yeah?

    Before your stupid social justice feminine [sic] bullshit, [mass murders] didn't happen on this scale, it's CRAZY. This is a disease of the modern age. YOU are responsible for perpetuating it, by disenfranchising these poor ****ing guys who don't have any options left. When someone takes the option of absolute INSANELY last resort, you have to wonder, what kind of system is producing them? And I'll tell you what, Laci, it is a ****ING FEMINIST SYSTEM THAT IS DOING THIS.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xM1NrSSHDSc

  13. Post
    He isn't blaming feminism for Intel's murdering people, merely pointing out that these kinds of things don't happen in a vacuum. The rise in violent lashing out of beta males is a very recent phenomenon, and the disenfranchised young men the internet generation have produced are something we've not had to deal with before.

    Sargon is also very much in UKIP, at least he was yesterday since he's still giving interviews on their YouTube channel, which would be odd had he been kicked out as you claim.

  14. Post
    If Sargon didn't get booted off Pateron that whole situation might have turned out differently.

  15. Post
    Esprit wrote:
    He isn't blaming feminism for Intel's murdering people, merely pointing out that these kinds of things don't happen in a vacuum. The rise in violent lashing out of beta males is a very recent phenomenon, and the disenfranchised young men the internet generation have produced are something we've not had to deal with before.

    Sargon is also very much in UKIP, at least he was yesterday since he's still giving interviews on their YouTube channel, which would be odd had he been kicked out as you claim.
    Yes he’s saying they happen because we live in a ‘feminist system’.. Cool I’ll concede the second point.

  16. Post
    Lethargic wrote:
    If Sargon didn't get booted off Pateron that whole situation might have turned out differently.
    Hmmm how so?

  17. Post
    Esprit wrote:
    He isn't blaming feminism for Intel's murdering people, merely pointing out that these kinds of things don't happen in a vacuum. The rise in violent lashing out of beta males is a very recent phenomenon, and the disenfranchised young men the internet generation have produced are something we've not had to deal with before.

    Sargon is also very much in UKIP, at least he was yesterday since he's still giving interviews on their YouTube channel, which would be odd had he been kicked out as you claim.
    The fact that he's in UKIP tells you he's far right, as they're a far right party

  18. Post
    kierbear wrote:
    The fact that he's in UKIP tells you he's far right, as they're a far right party
    If you are going to post atleast do it from your original account.

  19. Post
    SL1CKSTA wrote:
    If you are going to post atleast do it from your original account.
    I am.

  20. Post
    kierbear wrote:
    The fact that he's in UKIP tells you he's far right, as they're a far right party
    UKIP is not far right at all

    Their policies are actually liberal, they just want to be separate from Europe. They're socially conservative yet economically liberal.

  21. Post
    I was wondering about that too but realised I don't know much about UKIP.
    Wikipedia claims they've moved far right under recent leadership. But the evidence of that is their association with people such as Sargon ("Ukip gains 500 new members since allowing prominent far-right activists to join party"). This is the definition of circular logic.

  22. Post
    Opposed the introduction of same sex marriage
    Wants to repeal the human rights act
    Are climate change denialists
    Want to get rid of sex education in schools.


    How in the **** are they a liberal party? They're far-right and *always have been*.

  23. Post
    Economically liberal. They want to tell everyone what to do but they don't want to pay for any of it.

  24. Post
    Doesn't economically liberal mean right-wing anyway (not far-right, just regular right)?

    I mean, that's what Wiki says. Wiki also says UKIP are far right.
    Last edited by frio; 27th March 2019 at 8:52 pm.

  25. Post
    Yeah I don't think anyone minds being called right-wing, even if it's an oversimplification.
    It's just the "far right" thing has become a buzzword for "literally nazis", which isn't a fair approximation of the liberal mindset. With people like Sargon, some pushback is needed.

    Peterson is a liberal in this sense also, though he conducts himself differently and has earned more respect from the media.